Has this died by mutual consent? Did we get too deep too sudden? I haven’t even finished the book, myself.
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Bernard
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Andy
Driscoll quotes Madeleine L’Engle in a statement that perfectly summarizes the second chapter of Vintage Jesus:
To be a Christian is to believe in the impossible. Jesus was God. Jesus was Human.
And therein lies a fundamental difficulty for non-Christians in the acceptance of Jesus - that He was (is) fully human and fully God.
I found that Driscoll began to find a rhythm to his writing once he listed the various quotes from assorted writers and theologians as to the nature of Jesus. Being one who is not planning on the pastorate (no matter what my friend Will thinks), I found myself engaged by the differing viewpoints on the dynamic tension between Jesus’ humanity and divinity. So many traditions within the Christian faith are prone to an overemphasis between one or the other, and it is a tension that I find myself struggling with as well, particularly finding myself more prone to the overemphasis on his divinity and not understanding the importance of his humanity.
And on this point I believe Driscoll handles the balance between divinity and humanity well. Of note in page 36: “…when Jesus became a man, he did not change his identity as God but rather changed his role.” Furthermore he states that Jesus “laid aside the independent exercise of his divine attributes.”
Those two quotes really lay the foundation of Driscoll’s effective argument, as we see time and again through the Gospels how Jesus submits to the Father’s authority - that even with his divine nature, he acts only in concert with the will of God.
Driscoll brings his argument to a head on page 45 with what I believe to be the key takeaway for this chapter:
For those who are sick, abused, burned out, tired, bedridden, flat broke, tempted, weary, hated, lonely, and dying, the humanity of Jesus on his darkest days is encouraging. Without these insights into Jesus’ life, it would be difficult for us to run to him in our time of need because we would be unaware of the similar experiences he had during his life on the earth. Those experiences make him a compassionate friend. Therefore, the humanity of Jesus is as important for our love of Jesus as his divinity.
Jesus is the conduit by which God is able to relate to us, his children. We were unable to do so in Eden, unable to do so through the Law, but now we are able to connect with God because Jesus is our mediator, having lived among us, fully comprehending the breadth of the human experience.
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AJ
The Mark Driscoll - C.S. Lewis Connection
Thought I’d just point out an interesting facet of Chapter One and see what you guys made of it. Did you notice that at the end, Driscoll borrowed directly from C.S. Lewis, using his Liar/Lunatic/Lord trilemma? Lewis fan that I am, that scored some points with me. I thought it was an interesting move, though, since various people have argued that the trilemma is an invalid way of looking at Christ. (This approach, for example, adds the categories “Myth” and “Guru.” I guess it has to do with how far back Driscoll wants to start before he starts dealing with the person of Christ. Vintage Jesus isn’t really an apologetic work per say, so it doesn’t deal with “postmodernity” or “the historical reliability of the Bible.” Thoughts?
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Bernard
Is Jesus the Only God?
While Mark Driscoll doesn’t necessarily set out to create an apologetics text, he quickly finds himself having to deal with that issue. This first chapter does a good job of making us understand how Jesus would fit into today’s culture, and I’m not surprised by that, as Driscoll is so sensitive to culture.
He spends a lot of time discussing the various appearances of Jesus in pop culture, and to be honest I’m not sure what he was trying to accomplish. It makes for interesting reading. I am hoping to download some of the sermons from his Vintage jesus series; I’m curious as to how much transcription there was. I suspect that not only did he use his sermon material for the book, but some of the actual wording is a direct takeoff. Reading the book, I can so easily picture and hear Mark Driscoll as he preaches. The very style of his verbal delivery comes through in his writing, too.
This first chapter is a loose look at virtually everything that might be “thought” about Jesus, even offering a brief discussion of the demons thoughts about Jesus.
There’s a lot to discuss about this chapter, but for “book club” purposes, I want to grab onto a section from pages 21-23… “Jesus said He is God.” This is a bold statement of sorts, even though I personally agree. Driscoll’s first sentence in that section is this - “Jesus clearly, emphatically, and repeatedly said he is God.”
I suspect that Mark Driscoll is one of the most widely read and well read preachers I have personally listened to. This means that I am sure he has been exposed to multiple claims that “Jesus never said he was God.” I’ve heard it time and time again in discussions with atheists, agnostics, and even liberal Christians. He obviously knows that the Jehovah’s Witnesses use this line.
In my opinion, any time we say “Jesus clearly said He is God”, we need to be able to clearly back up our claim. I’m not sure Driscoll does a good job of that here. It is clear that the Jewish leaders were understanding Christ to claim to be God, and the use of “I am” is definitely a claim to being God. However, I’m still, personally, at a great loss as to convincing rebuttal to this claim.
To answer a naysayer with “Yes, He did,” but not have my “gun” fully loaded is frustrating to me. Make no mistake, I fully believe that Jesus was fully God. However, I’m not astute enough to have a verse in the Bible that I know right off the top of my head. If nothing else, Driscoll is encouraging me to “get my junk in a bag” and know what I’m talking about - at least know the Scriptures that drive my personal belief system. At least one Scripture.
Driscoll is the master of 10, 15, or more points in a sermon. In a way, I really like his approach to preaching. He doesn’t want to tease us, he wants to truly educate us as his listeners or readers. There have been thousands of sermons preached, thousands of books written, and thousands of songs sang about Jesus, God, the Holy Spirit, and Christianity in general. Yet, it’s still amazing that there are continually new ways being found to express our thoughts about this wonder that we call Life in Christ.
